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August 05, 2004

Swiftboat Veterans for Truth is doing for John Kerry what Farenheit 911 did for Bush

Swiftboat Veterans for Truth is a group of veterans depicted in the photo above that were not happy with the idea of John Kerry using a picture of them in his campaign.

It has been reported on some sites that they have hired a lawyer and demanded John Kerry cease and desist from using the photo above as part of his campaign and included legal threats.

Swiftvets.com has become incredibly popular and the media rankings for the website have been soaring on Alexa. Today the SwiftVets site is ranked by Alexa as the #5,143 most visited site. This is an alltime high for that website, and it is falling right behind GeorgeWBush.com at #5,002 and way behind JohnKerry.com at #1,902.

JohnKerry.com website's Alexa rankings have been soaring ever since his aggressive campaigning in the battleground states began.

Interesting Statistics:
Swiftvets.com today reached 3 out of every 1000 internet users.
GeorgeWBush.com today reached 3 out of every 1000 internet users
JohnKerry.com is leading in political web traffic with 5 out of every 1000 users

Please post comments on what you think about this issue.

Posted by Elouise at August 5, 2004 11:02 PM

Comments

This will totally result in a backlash against Bush, especially since John McCain even came out against it. I listened to other Republican spokespeople tonight on TV and they were also speaking against it and thought it needed to be investigated. I hope they do, because I know they will find Karl Rove behind it all and it is not going to be a good day for the Republicans when the truth comes out.

Posted by: Rebecca at August 5, 2004 11:27 PM

It is simply amazing that when F911 came out all we heard was 'they are trying to kill Free Speech'. Nevermind that 3/4's of the crock-u-mentary was based on innuendo and slight of hand. Now that the shoe is on the other foot, what is the first thing that the DNC did today? Called out the lawyers. These men served with Kerry, sure they may not have been in the same boat; however, investigate how these units were arranged. They know him and when Unfit for Command (#1 on Amazon in pre-release) comes out, it should be disastrous for the Kerry camp. No one shouted from the roof tops when the George Soros backed moveon.org was pulling its political punches in an attempt to buy the election, but now it is time for the pot to meet the kettle.

Posted by: Toni at August 6, 2004 05:26 AM

I would say that I normally disagree with this kind of politics, but I also think that with the way that the democrats and their supporters have been running such a dirty campaign they deserve this kind of treatment right back at them. I think this really got started when presidential candidate Al Gore decided to drop the bomb on George W. Bush (his people released information on George W. Bush's DUI just a week before the election). This was a sneaky, dirty, nasty trick and I'm glad as hell that they didn't get elected in the end because it was such filthy politics!

Now with all the propaganda from Michael Moore, moveon.org, the celebs, the news media, and I'd even go so far as to include Jay Leno, David Letterman, and all the other late night comics with the bunch, it has just been a filthy campaign by the democrats and all their supporters trying to oust George W. Bush from the White House (keep in mind I don't say that they want Kerry elected necessarily, I don't think anyone really wants that, they just want to get rid of George W. Bush). Excuse me for saying, but this has been by far the dirtiest presidential election by far compared to all that I've seen in the past, and things just keep heating up as the days pass. If you are careful enough to notice, a vast majority of the mud slinging has come from the democratic party (though they claim they are running a positive campaign).

No, this add is just the tip of the iceberg, believe me! From what I hear George W. Bush is still mad as hell at the Democrats for what they tried to do to him in the 2000 election, and based on his personality I am confident that he has lots of hot information to leak to the public just before the election.

Things to look forward to:

Weapons of Mass Destruction found and accounted for sometime in mid-October and Osama Bin Laden arrested in late October to early November.

There I have said it, I have made my prediction. And just you wait, all the democrats will fall in line like Howard Dean is right now in saying "Oh yeah, such interesting timing for this information to be released just before the election". Well they called the thunder in the 2000 election, so they will get what's coming to them! Don't you think if George W. Bush's DUI was such crucial information that it would be released sooner than a week before the election? But noooooo, they probably claim that they just received the tip the day before they released it.

I personally disagree with these tactics, but I'm still mad as hell that the democrats started it and I'm looking forward to George W. Bush ending it in November.

So for all you Democrats out there, please by all means keep running your mouths about the war in Afganistan and the war in Iraq. Keep asking us where the weapons of mass destruction are. Keep asking us where Osama Bin Laden is. We'll tell you in a few months.

Posted by: David at August 6, 2004 09:19 AM

On Sean Hannity's radio show, one of the SwiftBoat vets mentioned that their website was experiencing heavy loading due to denial of service attacks. So it probably isn't wise to take the raw number of hits as an indicator of favorable interest.

I'll wait to see if this is corroborated by survey results.

But as a Vietnam Vet opposed to Kerry, I'm glad to see this story getting some attention. I think Kerry's fourth months in Nam were less heroic than he claims, and are outweighed by what he did after returning stateside. I think his Winter Soldier testimony before the Senate, his leadership of VVAW, his affiliation with Michael Dukakis, and his voting record as a senator, provide a context which lends credibility to what the SwiftVets for Truth are saying about his military service.

Posted by: Charlie at August 6, 2004 09:33 AM

I think Kerry has a lot of chutzpah to base a campaign on a war he protested.

Posted by: Brian Hartman at August 6, 2004 10:55 AM

I find it funny that the Democrats are crying fowl....I am a democrat and am ashamed my party has turn into what it is today. They remind me of the bully that picks on the little kid on a daily basis, then when the kid has had enough and punches the bully in the mouth , he is the first one to run and say he hit me. I am also a Vet that thinks his behavior after his return is shamefull. Then to try and capitilize on his service record when it is Convenient to him is a disgrace. That to me shows his Character....NONE!
I can't in good conscience vote for this type of person. I would rather vote for him if he stood up for his convictions and stood by those convictions, and took the heat for doing so. But that is not what he does. I'm sorry Again, another character flaw. He voted to allow our President to go to war knowing full well what he was doing, then when the heat was on changed his tune. Another Character Flaw. Again i could not vote for that type person. I read how he wants to be like an ordinary guy that is just another one of working stiffs and he smiles as he peddles around on his $4000.00 dollar bicycle. I hate to inform him, I am an ordinary Joe and i sure as hell don't have a $4000.00 bike. I also eat at Wendys and don't have 5 star dinners made up for me instead.. I bet if you look at the financial worth of all the candidates you would probably be suprised to see George Bush is the poorest of them all. I can tell you this is one Democrat that is Voting for George Bush come November. I'll tell you why. Say what you want, but he hasn't swayed one ioda from his decisions and has taken the heat. Not once have i heard him sway from that path. To me that is a man that makes mistakes and lives with them. He is a man of convictions no matter who attacks him. That is why the French and rest don't like him. He can't be pushed around. Lets Face it we ARE the most powerfull Country in the World. We are finally acting like it. I truly hope John Kerry does not win, I don't want to be a third rate nation once again

Posted by: Larry at August 6, 2004 12:24 PM

When the Democrats do underhanded stuff they say This is America and we have protection by the first amendment, but when it's a Republican it's a dirty, vicious, underhanded thing and should not be brought up.

Nothing the Swift Boat Vets said was proven to be false or misleading. They stated they served with John Kerry not on his boat. Anybody with Military experience know's how that works. You can be in the same unit and not on the same boat, they stated that on many occasions they were on patrols with him, not more than 50 yards from his boat. That does not take into account the time spent around the base camp.

I am glad this has come to light and maybe if John Kerry, (the very John Kerry who chastised President Bush for not meeting with the NAACP and stated he would meet with any group regardless of whether he agrees with them or not) refused to meet with these vets and discuss the situation might not have this problem if he had just taken the meeting.

Posted by: Wayne at August 6, 2004 12:40 PM

As usual the Conservatives are missing the whole point. Regardless of what is being said about Kerry in Vietnam, he if fact did volunteer to fight to keep America safe. He didn't sit at a PC and complain about the Republicans. They want to strip this man of his Purple Hearts and his credibility. He is doing the same thing now as he did then when he got home. He wants to expose the injustices of a war that may never be won. What this Vietnam site has done is cause the Republicans to fight among themselves. It's dirty politics plain and simple. Give me a break. Try reading Kerry's war records on www.johnkerry.com it has acutal documents from his experiences in nam'

Take America Back! Vote Kerry/Edwards

Posted by: d. jones at August 6, 2004 01:37 PM

Even John McCain is saying that "Swift Vets" is underhanded and should not be listened to.

Posted by: Wayne Wilson at August 6, 2004 02:36 PM

I would simply like to remind folks like Wayne that "they" do not want to strip John Kerry of any of his medals. He did it himself. He took them off and put them on the steps of the capital.

Now before someone cries foul, I don't care whether it was ribbons or medals he put there. It makes no difference whether he tossed his bronze star or his Unit ribbons. The video (not the Swiftvets.com video, the old black and white video of the ex-soldiers making a pile of medals and ribbons on the steps) shows John Kerry putting whatever it was on the pile, just like the rest of the war protestors. He was a peace activist then, he's as close to a peace activist as a national politician today can be.

Bravo for the Swiftvets. If John Kerry can prove they're wrong, he will. If he can't, he's going to lose in states like Iowa, Michigan, Pennsylvania, Florida, and Missouri. He'd better do more than just call out the attorneys. He had better have something to back it up with.

Posted by: John at August 6, 2004 03:46 PM

The demos are complaining about who's funding the Swiftie adds but never mention a word of the G. Soros funding of anti-Bush propaganda and the Michael Moore lies. It seems like demos prefer lies to the word of the Swifties who served honorably. This seems to be typical of modern-day democrats. If Kerry's four months of Military Service as a Junior Officer is the best he can offer as a qualification for the highest office in the free world, the democrat party is in deep trouble.

Posted by: James at August 6, 2004 07:14 PM

I think both of them (President Bush and Senetor Kerry) should lighten up on each other. One of the above comments was talking about how negative this campaign has gotten, and I totally agree. They both need to focus on the issues (which probably would be bad for Kerry since his issue seems to be how bad Bush is, and not what he can actually do).
As for swift vets, michael moore, moveon.org, unfortunatly they have as much right to state their opinion as we do. We all won't agree with everything, but that is the nature of the beast. I believe that all of these organizations (or just really big people in moore's case) have put out their case(s) of their own volition. To blame republicans/democrats for not controlling their members or playing dirty politics for the actions of some of its members is wrong (or at the very least inaccurate). Just remember the one right that we don't have in this country. The right to not be offended. If you don't like what is being said or written or discussed just ignore it. There are some many avenues to recieve information these days that you can also verify what you hear or read if you take the time.
Any way Go Michael Bednarik (the libertarian candidate for those of you interested).

Posted by: James at August 6, 2004 07:17 PM

This is one fight that anyone without military service should stay out. The only comment I have is, I feel that Kerry disrespected out armed forces when he came back. It seems to me that when you train someone to kill the enemy, things will happen that are not very pretty. I for one respect the armed forces for what they are. They are there to protect our country, our allies. Our commander and chief has access to information we don't. That gives him insight.
We need to remember, all of us armchair quarterbacks, we don't have security clearance. That means we can't say what he should or shouldn't do.

Kerry made himself a target by trying to be all things to all people.

Posted by: Chris, OH at August 6, 2004 09:19 PM

If Bush would've waited or not even declared war on Iraq, where would our country be today? The world is a much better place without Saddam--The Iraqis are much better without Saddam.

America is supposed to be all about freedom. We shouldn't be the only one's in the world to experience freedom!!! Whether republican or democrat, how can anyone say what Bush done was wrong???

I, however, think it did take a republican (Bush) to get the job done and the message across. Now if all the politicians would leave Bush alone and finish the job, we could bring our troops home quicker. Kerry flip-flops everything he says. One minute he says we shouldn't have gone at all and the next, he says "we can't just pull out of there." And we can't.

Whether Kerry really was awarded the purple hearts or not... what kind of person receives them and then doesn't want them because of what he done in Nam (what little time he was there). Everyone else was there a hell of a lot longer than him.

Do we really want a man leading our country that was opposed to what he was doing in the first place? What kind of strings did he pull to only do 4 months there anyway?

Yes, I am a republican, but I would vote for the person that would do the best job in the White House. Why can't anyone see that Bush is the better candidate and when he took office, he was given a crappy economy and is slowly turning it around. No one needs to vote strictly along party lines. Look at the better choice in anything you do.

Posted by: kim at August 7, 2004 12:47 AM

Kerry is a man of conviction, as shown BOTH by his courage volunteering for service in Vietnam, and his subsequent protest of the same war when he learned that he had been wrong. The men closest to Kerry in the war believed in him then, and they believe in him now.

Conviction is not evidenced by the person who won't change his mind, it is practiced by the person who will act on what he believes.

Those who claim that Americans shouldn't make use of their God given right to free speech to speak out against an ill-advised, unjust war are:

Not in support of our Troops
Not in support of American Values
Not in support of the Truth

Such talk is the talk of authoritarians who have nothing in common with Americans, and everything in common with the enemies of America, from Osama Bin Laden to Saddam Hussein. Supposedly "Irresponsible" speech is the excuse that every authoritarian uses to squelch opposing views. Russian Communists used the notion recklessly and the Chinese still use it artfully.

So, he believed that the war was so unjust that he needed to make a dramatic statement, and leave the purple hearts on the Capitol steps; maybe in the hope of saving young lives on both sides? Hardly an ignoble act. Misguided, if you disagree with his conclusions, at worst.

And ideologues begrudge him this act, because they simply disagree with him about whether the war was just or wise, and for no other reason, except perhaps, that they also disagree with him about what to do for American today. Period.

Posted by: Matt at August 7, 2004 02:46 AM

So it was OK to question President Bush's military service but now it's bad to question Kerry's? Mr. Bush has always been open about his service. And to you lefties out there, flying high performance aircraft is always dangerous. So skip the "easy service" baloney already.
Kerry originally volunteered for the Swift Boats because at the time they were a fairly safe place. Only later did were they obligated to perform more dangerous roles, on orders from Admiral Zumwalt.
At this point in our history, we need a man who has the power of his convictions. And that ain't a lying windsock like John Kerry.

Posted by: Jon Lewis at August 7, 2004 09:08 AM

I just heard the other night on Fox news, that Kerry is somewhat like Jane Fonda. When she turn her back on the America people. Americans, please wake up and hear God's callling. He is Trying to tell each and one of us to open our eyes see what this man (Kerry) is trying to do our country. You talk about mass destruction. You have not seen nothing yet. We will be under his and Teresa Hines Kerry control. We need to stand up and take our COUNTRY back.... Democrats, talk about Bush is the blame for us goning to war. We was already in war the day on 9/11/01 when they struck the TWINS TOWERS!!!!!!!!! We did not have a choice except go to war. It was goning be us or them. Which would you have chose?

Posted by: Lori at August 7, 2004 09:45 AM

Kerry is not fit mentally to be president

Posted by: Campaign Manager at August 7, 2004 12:44 PM

I entirely agree with Toni's idea, but I would venture that will it happen in reverse: in mid October they'll capture Osama Bin Laden plus a few key top men, and then Bin Laden et al. will give up the location of the sites ten days before the election, which gives Bush a few days to capitalize on the glory right before the election. Bravo, I say, Bravo!! Any Bush strategists out there?!?
As to the other opinions ventured, I believe that charecter and integrety are the qualities voters will look to for a leader. The president proposes, Congress disposes. John Kerry is still campaigning like a Senetor, the Agent For Change, wile Bush enlarges upon his leadership role as an actual Governer. Being a lieutenant Governer is still being subservient, and as much as I personally despise Bill Clinton's personal morals, doggone it, he was a leader. That was directly from being, as was so elegantly put, 'on the hot seat', but Clinton chose deceict and the rest that eventually got him an impeachment vote. That there, my friends, is the difference, and one that will be on the voters minds come November.

Posted by: Dave at August 7, 2004 01:18 PM

i think its interesting all john kerry talks about is vietnam when the abuse of pris came out i hear rumsfiled should be fired, but he didnt abuse anyone yet kerry who wont talk about his record in the senate at all admitted himself that he personally was an abuser now how do the dem want rumsfiled head who didnt do it but wanna vote for john kerry who did where the consistency and how come kerry isnt proud of all the votes in the senate he runs away from it

Posted by: thomas daniel at August 7, 2004 06:58 PM

"Even John McCain is saying that 'Swift Vets' is underhanded and should not be listened to."

LOL. McCain might as well switch parties and get it over with. He's a classic RINO.

Posted by: Charlie at August 7, 2004 11:23 PM

It's funny how the Democrats at their DNC have accused George Bush of taking us to war against Irag all by himself and by doing so, have convieniently forgotten that on January 23rd, 2003, John Kerry said "Without question, we need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a Brutal, murderous dictator, leading an oppressive regime... He presents a particularly greivous threat because he is so consistanly prone to miscalculation... And now he is miscalculating America's response to his continued deceit and his cosistant grasp for weapons of mass destruction... SO THE THREAT OF SADDAM HUSSEIN WITH WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTIN IS REAL." Flippity floppity, Flippity floppity. Sounds like a flat tire to me and how about Hillary Clinton's statement on October 10th, 2002. She says "In the four years since the inpectors left, Intelligence reports show that Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weapon stock, his missle delivery capability, and his nuclear program. HE HAS ALSO GIVEN AID, COMFORT, AND SANCUARY TO TERRORISTS, INCLUDING AL QAETA MEMBERS. It is clear, however, that left unchecked, Saddam Hussein will continue to increase his capacity to wage biological warfar, and will keep trying to develope nuclear weapons." Flippity floppity, Flippity floppity. Sounds like another annoying flat tire to me! These are two of the most prominant morons in the Democrat party and two people who definitely ar not fit for the presidency. A truly fit nominee would be at least responsible to stick to their words and not run away from them!

Posted by: Ron at August 8, 2004 04:03 AM

The ad was totally misleading and anyone who has an inkling of intelligence should know that Medals are not just awarded to those who get family ties to help them avoid combat and also who desert during a time of war.
I’m sorry that would be the other guy. Instead I should be condemning Swift Vets for Truth for misleading people into thinking that a Junior Lieutenant couldn’t possibly be a good leader based on their obviously slanted views.

Maybe we should refresh people's knowledge of the ways certain Awards and Medals are issued since many seem to think they come from Bubblegum Machines?

Let’s start with the Purple Heart; any one can look up what the MOPH has posted on their website as criteria (http://www.purpleheart.org/Awd_of_PH.htm).

Key points:
1. The Purple Heart differs from all other decorations in that an individual is not "recommended" for the decoration; rather he or she is entitled to it upon meeting specific criteria.
2. A wound is defined as an injury to any part of the body from an outside force or agent sustained under one or more of the conditions listed above A physical lesion is not required, however, the wound for which the award is made must have required treatment by a medical officer and records of medical treatment for wounds or injuries received in action must have been made a matter of official record.
3. If adequate documentation is not available in the individual's service and/or health records, the individual may submit sworn affidavits from two eyewitnesses who have personal knowledge of the injury and the circumstances surrounding the incident in which the injury occurred.
4. Commanders must also take into consideration, the circumstances surrounding an injury, even if it appears to meet the criteria.
5. Examples of enemy-related injuries which clearly justify award of the Purple Heart are as follows:
a. Injury caused by enemy bullet, shrapnel, or other projectile created by enemy action.
b. Injury caused by enemy placed mine or trap.
c. Injury caused by enemy released chemical, biological or nuclear agent.
d. Injury caused by vehicle or aircraft accident resulting from enemy fire.
e. Concussion injuries caused as a result of enemy generated explosions.

Clearly even the bogus ad discredits itself when looking at this information. Medical Officer; LIED, Commanding Officer; LIED, One can only assume that everyone else attached to the video LIED as well.

But let’s look at the requirements for a Bronze Star… On second thought look them up yourself, I guess those in that group who have those Medals & Awards didn’t deserve them either, since they claim Kerry didn’t deserve his. Maybe they need to dust off a copy of SECNAVINST 1650 (AKA the Awards Manual)… Truthfully, it is a shame that as Veterans they can’t see beyond the petty BS, it is clear that most of the people in the ad never served under Kerry nor can they be believed to even have served with him. Here is a couple questions they should know the answers to; how many enlisted served on a PCF? What were their normal ratings? Look at the ad again and see how skewed it is. I say, once again, that anyone with half a brain can see this group has a dishonorable agenda and as a Veteran myself I think they should be ashamed of themselves.

Silver Star: "For conspicuous gallantry and intrepidity in action..."

Bronze Star Medal: "For heroic achievement (or meritorious achievement) (or meritorious service) (or heroic service) in connection with combat operations against the enemy (or operations involving conflict with an opposing foreign force)..."

True honorable veterans know that a deserter as Commander In Chief is one of the worst possible reflections upon themselves. Oh yeah, if you can’t find a spare copy of the Awards Manual you can get one here: http://neds.nebt.daps.mil/Directives/1650/1650.htm

Posted by: X at August 8, 2004 05:00 AM

Thank you, d. jones, for ilustrating a few key points. Kerry was protesting a war that HE felt could never be won. The injustices HE perceived in a war [yet, what war is not?]. I have no problem with Kerry laying his purple hearts at the steps of the Capitol. However, standing in front of CONGRESS in a nationwide spotlight and lie about the extant of the horrors being done by his comrades-in-arms, for crying out loud, that is betrayal on the same order of a married man spreading nasty rumors and talking about alleged affairs of their spouse on Jerry Springer without his wife there to answer the charges, and on national television, to the highest legislative body in the nation! Thius is betrayal, and the 'fighting' you perceive is actually a unified voice of disgust. No one has brought polictical demogougery into this until you have, and to do so does not contribute to the real purpose of this forum, which is to discuss the candidates, not their party or politial leanings. I ask this of you and anyone; this is about John Kerry and the swiftvets. This is about George Bush and farenheit 911. LET'S KEEP IT THAT WAY. Please?

Posted by: Dave at August 8, 2004 12:40 PM

I'm glad the Swift Boat Veterans are finally standing up for what they belive....the only reason Democrats are upset because they know the truth and in the end this will hurt Kerry's chance at the Presidency...I am not sure if Kerry should be soley judged on his military duty, but it will be a factor come election day. Everyone needs to research and find out about Kerry's voting record.....he voted against more money to the military, but in his acceptance speech at the convention he said he would give the military more funds....there has been numerous issues that he stays on both side of the fence...DON'T take any one persons word, find out for yourself.....the resources are available online......God Bless America!!

Posted by: Jo at August 8, 2004 02:03 PM

While much has been written about the identity and history of John E. O'Neill -- one of the authors of the forthcoming Regnery book Unfit for Command: Swift Boat Veterans Speak Out Against John Kerry (whose links in the GOP go back to his days as "protégé of Nixon-era dirty trickster Charles Colson") -- little has been said about his co-author, Jerome R. Corsi, PhD.

-- Corsi on Islam: "a worthless, dangerous Satanic religion"

--Corsi on Catholicism: "Boy buggering in both Islam and Catholicism is okay with the Pope as long as it isn't reported by the liberal press"

--Corsi on Muslims: "RAGHEADS are Boy-Bumpers as clearly as they are Women-Haters -- it all goes together"

--Corsi on "John F*ing Commie Kerry": "After he married TerRAHsa, didn't John Kerry begin practicing Judiasm? He also has paternal grandparents that were Jewish. What religion is John Kerry?"

--Corsi on Senator "FAT HOG" Clinton: "Anybody ask why HELLary couldn't keep BJ Bill satisfied? Not lesbo or anything, is she?"

Unfit for Command has received wide media coverage recently, in part because of hype on The Drudge Report and the website Human Events Online, which is offering a sample chapter via e-mail, and in part as a result of Swift Boat Veterans for Truth's new attack ad on Kerry's service in Vietnam. The book has skyrocketed to the top of the Amazon.com "Top Sellers" list, as of August 6.

Corsi received his PhD in political science from Harvard University in 1972; his dissertation was titled Prior Restraint, Prior Punishment, and Political Dissent; a Moral and Legal Evaluation. Previously, he co-authored a report on the 1967 riots in Cleveland, titled "Shoot-out in Cleveland: Black Militants and the Police," published in 1968 by the National Commission on the Causes and Prevention of Violence.

In addition to Unfit for Command, Corsi has written books on a variety of subjects, and is currently the vice president of development and senior editor of U.S. Financial Marketing Group. Recently, he has been contributing articles to the website wintersoldier.com on the subject of Senator John Kerry's record as an anti-war activist following his service in the Vietnam War.

In this series of articles, Corsi has accused Kerry of "violating the legal provision against negotiating with foreign powers (18 U.S.C. 953) and the constitutional prohibition against giving support to our nation's enemies during wartime (Article III, Section 3)"; asserted that Kerry's actions as an anti-war activist amounted to treason; and claimed that "Kerry and the VVAW consistently coordinated their efforts with Communists." Corsi asserted that, in 1971, Kerry's anti-war activism amounted to a proclamation by him that "Communists were right in maintaining that American values were corrupt and that the only solution was for America to capitulate so Communism could continue to spread." As Media Matters for America has noted, Kerry was quoted expressing exactly the opposite sentiment in a December 12, 1971, Boston Globe article: "I don't like Communists," Kerry said. "In fact, I hate them. I hate all totalitarians. I'm totally dedicated to representative, pluralistic, free democracy."

On August 6, Salon.com's Joe Conason documented links between Swift Boat Veterans for Truth and the conservative online forum www.FreeRepublic.com. Conason noted that the designer of the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth website is Robert A. Hahn, a director of the Free Republic Network, a conservative activist organization affiliated with FreeRepublic.com. Scott Swett, who is listed as the webmaster of the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth website, swiftvets.com, also appeared on FOX News Channel host Sean Hannity's August 5 radio show to discuss the group. Swett posts frequently to FreeRepublic.com, using the pseudonym "Interesting Times," and is also a director of the Free Republic Network. The wintersoldier.com website to which Swett has contributed articles is a project of the Free Republic Network.

Corsi is also a frequent participant in FreeRepublic.com's online forums, posting under the pseudonym "jrlc" since 2001. (Click here to read a full set of Corsi's posts; click here to read the post in which "jrlc" admits to being Jerome Corsi.)

On FreeRepublic.com, Corsi has, among other things, said that "ragheads" are "boy buggers"; referred to "John F*ing Kerry"; called Senator Hillary Clinton a "Fat Hog"; referred to her daughter as "Chubby Chelsie" Clinton; referred to Janet Reno as "Janet Rhino"; called Katie Couric "Little Katie Communist"; suggested Kerry was "practicing Judaism"; and expressed the wish that a small plane that had crashed into a building in Los Angeles had instead crashed into the set of NBC'S The West Wing, thereby killing actor Martin Sheen.

Following are some examples. [Spelling and punctuation are Corsi's own.]

On Catholics and the Pope

CORSI: Maybe while he's there he can tell the UN what he's going to do about the sexual crimes committed by "priests" in his "Church" during his tenure. Or, maybe that's the connection -- boy buggering in both Islam and Catholicism is okay with the Pope as long as it isn't reported by the liberal press. (03/03/2003)

CORSI: So this is what the last days of the Catholic Church are going to look like. Buggering boys undermines the moral base and the laywers rip the gold off the Vatican altars. We may get one more Pope, when this senile one dies, but that's probably about it. (12/16/2002)

On Islam and Arabs

CORSI: Let's see exactly why it isn't the case that Islam is a worthless, dangerous Satanic religion? Where's the proof to the contrary? (04/24/2004)

CORSI: Islam is like a virus -- it affects the mind -- maybe even better as an analogy -- it is a cancer that destroys the body it infects... No doctor would hesitate to eliminate cancer cells from the body. (11/26/02)

CORSI: Islam is a peaceful religion as long as the women are beaten, the boys buggered, and the infidels killed. (11/22/2002)

CORSI: How's this as an analogy -- the Koran is simply the "software" for producing deviant cancer cell political behavior and violence in human beings. (02/15/2002)

CORSI: Think the liberal press will ever let out that these 2 were lovers -- typical Islamic boy-buggering -- older man, younger man -- black Muslims? I doubt it. Not a pretty picture, but one certain to be hidden by PC media. (11/08/2002)

CORSI: Isn't the Democratic Party the official SODOMIZER PROTECTION ASSOCIATION of AMERICA -- oh, I forgot, it was just an accident that Clintoon's first act in office was to promote "gays in the military." RAGHEADS are Boy-Bumpers as clearly as they are Women-Haters -- it all goes together. (11/18/2001)

On Senator John Kerry

CORSI: First let's undermine the US in Vietnam. Then we can go for gay marriage. When you get to be Pres. JFK-lite, there will be no end to how much of America we can destroy. (05/17/2004)

CORSI: Just don't let anybody put a tablet with the Ten Commandments in front of the school where that girl wants to wear a Muslim scarf -- OH, No --- then the RATS would complain. Anti-Christian, Anti-American -- just like their Presidential Candidate -- Jean Francois Kerrie. (03/31/2004)

CORSI: After he married TerRAHsa, didn't John Kerry begin practicing Judiasm? He also has paternal gradparents that were Jewish. What religion is John Kerry? (03/04/2004)

CORSI: Kerry has a long history of Communist supporters. (03/12/2004)

CORSI: Kerry offers a clear choice. Anti-American hatred. (02/08/2004)

CORSI: John F*ing Commie Kerry and Commie Ted [Kennedy] discuss their plan to hand America over to our nation's enemies. (02/04/2004)

On former President Bill Clinton

CORSI: When is this guy going to admit he's simply an anti-American communist? Won't he and his leftist wife simply go away???? Enough already. (02/24/2002)

CORSI: Hey, Bill, didn't you steal enough when you had the chance? (02/15/2002)

CORSI: Clinton doesn't get it. Afganistan, and other Moslim countries, are not poor because they lack money. The culture itself is anti-modern. But then, maybe Slick did get it and he just wants to create another bork barrel from which he and his wife can draw slop. (02/15/2002)

CORSI: Clinton was more interested in gays in the military than going after OBL. Clinton had Janet Rhino pushing the FBI to deport a child to Castro's nondemocratic Cuba, not searching out OBL sleepers in the USA. Clinton was too busy getting BJs in the Oval Office to do more than Wag the Dog after the Cole was hit. (05/16/2002)

On Senator Hillary Clinton

CORSI: HELL-ary loves the Arabs so much (kiss, kiss Mrs. Arab*RAT) -- wonder how she would look in a Burkha? (05/21/2002)

CORSI: Mullah Ali'Gore-ah is very proud of his new Bin Laden beard and he hopes others in the Democratic Party will follow his lead. Hell-ary is disappointed she cannot grow a beard, but her press secretary reminds us she can still enroll in flight school. (01/07/02)

CORSI: Let the FAT HOG run!!! [regarding a possible presidential bid] (08/30/2003)

CORSI: Hellary should resign and go away. What ever happened to the people she ran over with her car at Westchester Airport? Can't anybody sue this b*tch? (11/17/2002)

CORSI: Anybody ask why HELLary couldn't keep BJ Bill satisfied? Not lesbo or anything, is she? (06/08/2003)

On Chelsea Clinton

CORSI: According to Talk Magazine, Chubby Chelsea had a very great adventure on 9/11 in NYC and Hell-ary had the details wrong -- oh, it was terrible. (12/07/2001)

CORSI: Did the Journalist see Chubbie Chelsea among the wives. Little Katie Communist [Katie Couric] on the NBC Today show interviewed Hillary this morning and mom is worried sick about Chelsea. She was last seen in Kandahar at a Starbucks. But now, as Little Katie Communist sighed, "Who Knows?" Even British disinformation planted reports such as this grocery crap will be useful. Anyone with information about Chubbie Chelsea's whereabouts should post it now. Mom wants to know her daughter is out of harms way. Mom also wants to be at the center of the story. (11/29/2001)

CORSI: But the real question is: WHERE IS CHUBBIE CHELSEA? Is she in Kabul in danger, looking for a Starbucks? Waldo wants to know. Please, Little Katie Communist, HELP US FIND CHELSEA. THE SITUATION MAY BE URGENT. (11/29/2001)

CORSI: HILLARY SAYS CHELSEA IS MISSING AND JANET RHINO DOESN'T KNOW WHERE SHE IS? (11/28/2001)

On former Vice President Al Gore

CORSI: Gore isn't available for television. He is growing his regulation length Bin Laden beard. Mullah Ali'Gore-ah, as he now wishes to be called, is focused on his new career as a pilot. "Want to fly like bird," he says after his stint as a professor at Columbia. "No need to learn take-off or landing, just soar like bird and look at buildings." As to Florida, Mulllah Gore-ah says, "No big buildings," dismissing the importance of the state to his future plans." (12/15/2001)

Posted by: Becky - A Registered Republican at August 8, 2004 05:40 PM

The arguments made by the liberals is truely getting to be pathetic. The funny part of all this is that throughout all the media coverage I've seen, everyone is spouting off about Bush not condemning the ads, blah, blah, blah.
Kerry has brought this all on himself. HE chose to use his "hero" status as a political tool. People have got to realize a few things here. Bush didn't put anyone up to the ads. How would you feel if you spent an ammount of time in combat, watched friends die, maybe gotten injured yourself and been awarded a medal, all to have someone else only spend 4 months in combat and recieve the same medals for very minor and possibly fraudulent injuries? Don't you think these guys have been ticked off at John Kerry for quite some time and felt for whatever reason that since Kerry has used his vet status in a Presidential election that maybe the public would need to know the truth?
If you have never served then you may never understand, but if these allegations are true(and I believe them to be)the John Kerry is one of the most vile men to try to take the highest office of the United States, and I cannot imagine anyone in their right mind feeling safe as a member of the military if Kerry is elected.

And as a side note to d. jones, if I want to know about Kerrys war records, why on earth would I go to johnkerry.com ?!? What, like he's going to have anything other that glowing reviews of himself? If that web site has been your only source of information, I can see where you get your views and I pity you.

God Bless The USA and God Bless Bush

Posted by: Chad B at August 9, 2004 12:20 AM

I have gone to the swiftboatvets website and I looked at John Kerry's fitreps. My husband has been in the Navy for 14 years and has seen many fitreps.
It appears that the fitreps he released are at best. In 1,the Commanding Officer has 3 men to evaluate and rank and doesn't see any of them to be fit for the #1 slot!! Also, the majority of these fitreps are non-observed which means he had not been around long enough to be watched and ranked.
He also didn't even rank as early promote (or back then accelerated promote) when he was only ranked against himself as an aide to a rear admiral!!
Now on to other things-it doesn't matter what kind of officer he was. He did go over there. It seems for personal reasons.He wanted to go into public office. Is that the sole purpose of Vietnam for him? I believe so since he only served 4 months. His big downfall is the way he acted AFTER coming home. He was a traitor to his Country. He talked out against the military and desecrated the names of those who have fought and died for this country!! He threw his medals away (well, someone's medals that he claimed at the time were his) Why run on the fact that he even received them? They meant nothing to him.
People can put their own names in to receive medals. It is not looked upon with dignity but if someone REALLY wants out of somewhere-they can make it happen. Maybe he was given the Purple Hearts when he requested them to get him out of there because he was not fit to serve in a combat environment.
There are Vets, who on Memorial Day, put their old uniforms on and proudly pin their medals on. They remember how and who they served with. They are proud to have served this Country. They don't throw the medals away in "protest" and disregard their service until it deems profittable to them.
It is hard to see a man want to be President who totally went against the men (and now women) who he wants to lead. He wants to be their commander-in-chief!! How can they serve honorably and proudly for someone who despises what they do? We already had military-haters in the White House-for 8 years!!!! Please don't do that to the armed forces again!
This is an important election. We need to let Bush finish his job with the war on terror!! He is doing a great job with it! It is a slow and steady fight but we are making progress. We need to stay the course and we will succeed!

Posted by: Teresa G at August 9, 2004 12:35 AM

If you don't look hard...you can find bad things on Kerry AND Bush I am sure...

The parts that get me though...are so many of the things Kerry is usuing to prove he is fit to be Commander and Chief are very misleading to the average public...he has had two sides to everything from the beggining of his service to the US Government...from his service in the way...to his views on healthcare, abortion, economics....he views change with the political wind, as far as I can tell Bush stays with his same thoughts...his same goals...he actually backs up his own policies...with action.

Over 2,400,000 people have watched this video about Kerry on iraq....watch it...listen to the comments from others...

http://www.kerryoniraq.com/

Watch that...then read vets against kerry...then swiftboats against kerry....then do your own research on his voting record...even in his acceptance speach...he said no one would send troops to war...then not support them...yet Kerry didn't support them.

He is catholic...and things life begins at conception...yet votes for partial birth abortion

He says he believes in the values of families...yet voted to give out the 'morning after pill' to teens with out parental consent

He says he is for new fuel ideas...yets votes for higher fuel taxes and against ethanol??

He says he is the average american...yet he can't actually state if he owns his SUV or if his 'family' does....he is the average joe...yet votes against tax relief bills -- that give money BACK to the average family.

He makes fun of the 'no child left behind act' yet my daughters school was just awarded the 'school of excellance' award...because they have a 97% passing grade due to the 'no child left behind act'

He says he wants America to be a strong country again (?? like we are not?) and he wants us to be independant to be able to make our own decisions...yet he wants us to use the UN to make our decisions...he wants us to rely on allies more...he wants us to unite more with other countries and be more united in voting policies about iraq....

If someone attacks the US again....who takes care of it...the US of A...if someone was to bomb Australia or Brittian or anyone really.....WHO WOULD they come to for force of strength....the US of A

Go visit http://www.kerryoniraq.com/ and then tell me you want this man running this country....our troops...and our economics....

I dare you

Vote Bush...if you have any idea what is actually going on in the world today...and you want a leader who isn't afraid to voice his opinion and stand BY THAT SAME OPINION...you can't flip flop when the whole country is at stake...

Shanna

Posted by: GreenEyes at August 9, 2004 01:11 AM

Okay, Becky(8-8-04, 5:04 p.m.), so Corsi is an ignorant, inflammatory, bigoted and insensitive idiot. So what has that to do with the Swiftvets? In documenting their story, and recounting Kerry's attacks on his comerades-in-arms, nonfiction in its very essence eschews personal opinion or ignorance. Corsi is (or should be, at any rate) well aware that this the Swiftvets story, and the Swiftvets, to a person, would have to approve its contents before publication, or withdraw the book. He has his own forum to act like a jackass. I appreciate the comprehensive detailing of Corsi's comments, they are enlightening to his personal convictions, but that does not discredit the Swiftvets story out of hand. Read the book before you say whether it is credible or not, and to paraphrase an old adage, 'never judge a book by its authors'.

Posted by: Dave at August 9, 2004 01:20 AM

I find it interesting that, none of President Bush's fellow Serviceman in that very Questionable time period of His so called
call to Duty have surfaced. This is Important to Voting for Relection.
patrickgannon...Viet-Nam 68' 69'.

Posted by: patrickgannon at August 9, 2004 11:10 AM

This will be my last comment on this site -- it makes me not only ill, but profoundly sad, how your absolute blind loyalty to GWB will allow you to believe the ugly lies of the swiftvets , produced through bitterness from a war fought over 30 years ago – a war where the Secretary of Defense, Robert S. McNamara himself came out years later and said we were wrong to go to war (and has recently spoken out against the war in Iraq – I watched him speak about this on C-Span.)

My brother graduated from West Point; served two terms in Vietnam; fought in the jungles and saw much horror while serving, with great honor, his country; retired as a Full Colonel, and today, believes 100% in Kerry’s honor and truthfulness. I have learned much from my brother on how it was during that war, and anyone who thinks they can capture the essence of what happened during that war in a few sound bits, or a book filled with hate for a man who they feel betrayed them because he spoke the truth, I feel nothing but a profound sense of sadness for you all.

And when I am told by a Bush supporter that I should not judge a book by it's aurthors, the very authors who are are trying to tell me the "truth," and I find through much research that these authors are liers; then I know I am in troubled waters and must get out of here.

I have gone done much reading on the issues at stake, I have gone to the source and read in detail the many polices both candidates are running on, and how each candidate has conducted themselves while serving their country – as soldiers and as elected officials, and my vote is unequivocally for John F. Kerry!!!!

Posted by: Becky - A Registered Republican at August 9, 2004 03:23 PM

I have a real problem with Mr. Kerry trying to keep these swift boat vets from using the 1st amemdment, Freedom of speach. The desparate attempts to sue media and use threatening tactics to keep them from getting their message out. The democrats use the media in any manner they choose, simply by throwing issues, whether true or not, against the wall to see what sticks and then running with the popular ideas. I want to make my own dicisions and do not want to be spoon fed what the media thinks I should know! Censorship is usually fought against, unless it hurts their party. Kerry could just clear this whole topic up if he would just release his service records, all of them. Kerry has something to hide and this is just one of the many reasons he is not fit to be President! I do not want another four years or possibally eight of I didn't inhale and I never had sex with that woman. This story needs to get out and let the voting public make the decision whom is the better candidate.

The Presidency is far to important a held office to be given to someone primarily due to the fact that the current President is not well liked. I like him because he is getting the job done, not just holding summits to talk about what should be done.

Posted by: Steve at August 9, 2004 06:10 PM

Steve,
In your haste to blame Kerry for whatever, you state that he is trying to sensor the book. No where have I seen where this is true. Yes, there are MANY people who are uncovering the lies of the authors, who are making public statments -- including John McCain -- against the untruths and ugliness of the book -- but Kerry, himslef, is not actively seeking to do anything about this book but ignore it. He has had these people go after him since he first spoke out to the congress in 1971. They have never been able to prove anything they claim, but instead have always been countered with the truth -- yet they still try each time someone from the extreme right wring of the Republican party decides they need to play dirty politics. So, once again, we will let the attacks hit the walls and will once again see that nothing sticks but the scum and sickening smears left by the SwiftVets lies.

Posted by: harriet at August 9, 2004 10:42 PM

Hey Steve,

The problem with Clinton is not that he didn't inhale. It is that he didn't exhale. Tee Hee!

Posted by: Ron Crafton at August 10, 2004 01:01 AM

Becky, we are sad as well to see you go, because you believe so strongly about Kerry and his ideas. That is what this forum is about, to explore all viewpoints and have fun exploring them. No one bears personal malice to another in expressing their opinions, and that is all they are- opinions. I have noticed, and with no criticism, that you tend to respond by telling those who oppose your viewpoint are wrong, rather than why you are right. So enlighten us further. Tell us why Kerry is the man for the job. We all get frustrated when we feel we aren't being heard, as you may feel now. But you are being heard. What's more, you owe it to Kerry. Of anyone, you have stated his case most elequently on this forum, and we marvel at it. Really. And agree or disagree,we benefit from all points of view and learn from them. In the end, it's like what I heard, I believe, Robin Williams when he said some twenty years ago, "The difference between Democrats and Republicans is the difference between Syphillis and Ghonorrea-- either is just a common infection of the body politic".
I am a supporter of Bush only in principle. I am an avowed Libertarian, and while we should crush those who attacked us, and it is our right and obligation to in defense of our country in response to an act of declared war, I do not agree with a policy of "perpetual war for perpetual peace". I understand Kerry's position and opposition to Vietnam. We all do, because thirty-five years later, we all realize Kerry was right to oppose what he felt was wrong. We all have that right. It is a basic tenet of our freedom. But why would he exaggerate, if not outright lie about the extant of the wartime atrocities being committed by his own comerades-in-arms? Forget Coursi. Forget politics. Even forget the Swiftboat vets and their book and website. Just tell me why Kerry would misrepresent the facts- and the facts were, yes, there was killing of civilians. There was raping of teenage girls. Whole villages were burned, and men, women and children were shot in cold blood. No war is free of such atrocities. But it was rare, and few got away with it. Kerry probably felt by painting a more gruesome picture, the outrage would help end the war sooner. That was flawed thinking, for two reasons: one, war does not work like that. And two, the means- lying and deceit- did not justify the ends, even if he were successful, and his motives sincere. It didn't justify Watergate, it didn't justify Iran-Contra, and it didn't justify MonicaGate (I never had sex with that...that woman). So please tell us why Kerry can be justified in what he did, when it turned honest fighting soldiers, your brother included, into molester, rapists and murderers, without cooberating evidence and with the accused not having the opportunity to defend themselves or being able to answer Kerry's charges in an equal forum before Congress. That is the focus of this whole forum, and despite the hundreds of contributions, no one has answered that question.
Not even Kerry himself.
So, c'mon, Becky, let's lighten up and continue the debate! We want you to speak your mind. We await your next posting. With open arms.

Posted by: Dave at August 10, 2004 02:47 AM

TO: Dave at August 8, 2004 12:40 PM

Since when did you become web master? I know enough about this swiftvets site not to even bother to read it, and on the other hand, I have never seen 911. I don't have to, I have lived through that horror. In addition, my Mom worked at Lowrey's Air Force Base in Denver, CO during nam' I was a kid, and saw everything from American Soldiers with their mouth half shot off, to some American's gone mentally insane. Let me ask you a qustion. Does the Iraq prison scandle and court martials ring a bell? Wars have laws, and when those laws are broken, court martials are held, and some people with character will testify to the truth of any crime here or abroad. You need to learn the difference between betrayal and the ability to follows policy. You can start with those of the Geneva Convention as related to wars.

Vote: Kerry/Edwards Take America Back!

Posted by: d. jones at August 10, 2004 03:09 AM

P.S. If you are smart, you will do as I am about to do. Search the web and learn what incentives are being paid to the Swiftboat Veterans for Truth participants for coming out with this site so close to election time. I know 911 made millions for Moore, and I know some money is floating around somewhere for this Swiftboat Veterans for Truth. For heavans sake, they weren't even on the same boat!

Vote: Kerry/Edwards Take America Back!

Posted by: d. jones at August 10, 2004 03:16 AM

There are so many things that bother me about Kerry's character. One that stands out is that he threw away his medals as a sign of protest. When he became senator, a reporter noticed that he had his medals showcased on a wall. When asked how he got his medals back, Kerry said that the medals he threw away were somebody else's. Isn't this reminiscent of "I voted for it before I voted against it." This tells me that his anti-war stance was not authentic. This is Kerry having his cake and eating it too. The political winds then was anti-war. His entry into politics was based on his Senate testimony where he slandered the fighting men and women in Vietnam. The man has no conscience.

I feel for the souls of the American men and women who perished during the Vietnam war. Your sacrifice is being desecrated by an egotistical maniac who will do anything to become president.

If Kerry wins, I pray to God that I am wrong about him, for the sake of my young children.

Posted by: Carlos Encarnacion at August 10, 2004 04:35 AM

Did Kerry do anything after Vietnam? Why is he not talking about his record in the senate? I'm tired of hearing about four month of his life and ignoring the last 20 years. Thats where the issue is. He is not good for the U.S.

Posted by: Vietnam ed at August 10, 2004 12:09 PM

For all of you who claim the SwiftVets are liars, please, I beg of you show me some proof! I am more inclined to believe a Retired Navy Captain, and a Retired Admiral, (both highly decorated by the way) before I would believe a war protester who sat in on meetings that discussed assasinating United States Senators.

Show me your proof. I bet you are the same ones who fail to see that Michal Moore cut and edited his F911 movie to show things his way. Heck I could make Ghandi look like satan doing the same thing.

Oh yeah "X" John Kerry's commander told him to get out of his office when he came in with a scratch and he also refused to put him in for a Purple Heart and has no idea how he got it, since his scratch was from a wound recieved by firing a gernade launcher too close and getting hit by schrapnell. To be honest, If I had been on the boat when he did that we would not be having this conversation today. He endangered everyones lives in that instance. Everyone on the boat at the time said they received no hostile fire at all. This was not Kerry's crew, he had not been given one by that time.

He enlisted in the Navy to get Swift boats because they were usually far from the action. He did this only because he got his draft notice and tried to get a 1 year extension so he could go to Paris and study. When that was turned down he enlisted so he would at least have a possible say as to where he might go. I see no honor in doing that.

Posted by: Wayne at August 10, 2004 02:19 PM

Once again, why would Kerry lie, forgive me, exaggerate? No one disputes the horrors of Vietnam. The trouble with war is it does not always follow protocol. The North Vietnamese weren't always paragons of virtue, and no matter what side you were fighting for, those who commit those violations obviously don't give a rip about the Geneva convention, and that includes those in Iraq. Were there court-martials in Vietnam? You bet your southern exposure. Kerry insinuated, even by exaggerating, that protocol was not being followed to a greater degree than it actually was, and the court-martials and discipline were not being followed. The Swiftvets and every soldier who served are right to be mad as hell to be misrepresented in such a manner. The unfounded charge that they are getting paid off [and I quote:"If you are smart, you will do as I am about to do. Search the web and learn what incentives are being paid to the Swiftboat Veterans for Truth participants for coming out with this site so close to election time. I know 911 made millions for Moore, and I know some money is floating around somewhere for this Swiftboat Veterans for Truth"]. That is an exact echo of Kerry, and right out of his playbook.
Enough of this nonesense. I will not be lured into a verbal tennis match, and as for being webmaster, this is a free forum and it disturbed me that someone would withdraw from this free, open and constructive debate. Let us continue, and allow Becky, for whom my respect has grown profound, speak for herself.
Becky, I wish to personally apologize to you and to everyone reading this for this foolishness. I will confine future comments to about something else besides the swiftvets and Vietnam. And d. jones, let us agree to disagree, and leave it at that.

Posted by: Dave at August 10, 2004 03:14 PM

Hey Harriet,

There are way too many issues wrong with Kerry's own statements which are found to be lies. Kerry has nine guys standing beside him and 224 standing against him. Harriet, your guy Kerry is not fit to be president in so many was, and I do not respond in haste. Kerry seems to blow with the wind in what he believes. I have always believed if you don't stand for something, you will fall for anything.

Harriet, you Dem's can dis*** out...

Posted by: Steve at August 10, 2004 03:56 PM

Kerry is a war veteran. He should be proud. However, based on his political record will he have the fortitude to protect America from terrorists.

Vote Bush, Whatever his faults he gives 100% to protect Americans. He took a political risk by invading Iraq. He knew the next election would be on the line. What a breath of fresh air after 8 years of Clinton to have a President who will take a stand based on his convictions and not motivated by the polls. So Kerry is a war hero, that's great, but what about the Senate. Where were his votes. Tnink about it

Posted by: Queens,NY at August 10, 2004 04:55 PM

Kerry is a war veteran. He should be proud. However, based on his political record will he have the fortitude to protect America from terrorists.

Vote Bush, Whatever his faults he gives 100% to protect Americans. He took a political risk by invading Iraq. He knew the next election would be on the line. What a breath of fresh air after 8 years of Clinton to have a President who will take a stand based on his convictions and not motivated by the polls. So Kerry is a war hero, that's great, but what about the Senate. Where were his votes. Think about it

Posted by: Queens,NY at August 10, 2004 04:55 PM

Dave: It works for me.

Vote: Kerry/Edwards

Posted by: d. jones at August 10, 2004 07:10 PM

HERES THE BOTTOM LINE HERE:

YOU CAN'T GET MEDALS UNLESS IT GOES THROUGH A REVIEW BOARD. THE PEOPLE IN CHANGE OF RATING KERRY'S PERFORMANCE BACK THEN OBVIOUSLY DIN"T THINK HE HAD DONE ANYTHING WRONG. THESE PEOPLE WE'RENT ON JOHN KERRY'S SWIFTBOATS HE COMMANDED.

IF YOU QUESTIONING JOHN KERRY'S MEDALS, THEN YOUR QUESTIONING EVERYONE'S MEDALS... AND THATS NOT SMART.
THIS WILLL BEACKFIRE, CAUSE ITS A DIRTY TRICK AND OBVIOUSLY HAS NO CREDIBILITY AND IS COMPLETELY POLITICALLY MOTIVATED.
IF IT WASN'T POLITICALLY MOTIVATED, THEY"D HAVE CLAIMED THIS 30 YEARS AGO.

and whats the deal with compaigning this to f-9/11? Um NO! F-9/11 actually is factual, and it may be cut together in a way to force the point home, it is not innacurate. His facts are solid and the clips of Bush should be enough to show you who Bush really is. Don't strike down moore's movie jkust cause your pissed that the president is an arrogant A**-h***, who considers the wealthist americans "his base".
The media attacked the movie, and said it was full of lies, but if yo0u check it out yourself, (go to Michaelmoore.com and read his notes and sources), you'll see that the media is actually lying.. gee I wonder why? OH YUEAH, ITS CAUSE THEY'RE PISSED THAT THEY GOT DISSED BY HIS MOVIE; CAUSE THEY DIDN'T SHOW US THE TRUTH.

Lets get a better america built back up again, we were going in the right direction until Bush came and screwed our economy up, got us attacked, and got us into Iraq. Lets get someone into office that actually cares about us, and not just money and power.

Kerry's got the best plan I've seen. It will work, because it will bring back our intellectualism, our technology, and we can contribute to the world, and grow our economy, by being inventive, and smart again. Thats what got us this far. and it can get us off of middeast oil, and give us a new product to seel the the world to grow our economy. Stop listening to the media machines, and read JohnKerry.com
Lets make our future better, and take the country OUT of the hands of the big corporations. Its OUR country.

I'm voting for Kerry this November 2nd.

Posted by: Peace + Love at August 10, 2004 09:52 PM

Since the primary season began and Vietnam became an issue I have wondered where the anti-Kerry swiftboaters were - better late than never. This country neds George W. Bush for 4 more years. I have a dream - after Bush's re-election I want to e-mail Kerry with two words "MISSON ACCOMPLISHED"

Posted by: Arly S. at August 11, 2004 12:36 AM

This is America. People have the right to stand up for what they believe. In the words of Dr. Martin Luther King “A man who won't die for something is not fit to live.” Kerry put his wealthy American life on the line for our country. He also had the American right to contest the injustices of the war based on his experiences by the peaceful protest of his choice. Just as we all have the American right to freely comment on this site. We are not a barbaric people, out for blood! We are in fact a very intelligent Country, very defensive of our way of life, our rights and our freedoms. When someone as the current Bush Administration tests our intelligence, when we are attacked on our own soil, then we will promptly and very forcefully respond. The fight no longer becomes Democratic or Republican it becomes American.

Vote Kerry/Edwards 2004

Posted by: d. jones at August 11, 2004 01:34 AM

I have been following the swiftvets since their little noticed press conference in May. Mr. Kerry has brought this on himself. He has chosen to make his Vietnam service the central theme of his campaign and in doing so has made the mistake of under estimating and ,in my view, insulting americans (especially veterans) in the sense that most people would not be interested enough to pay attention. Mr Kerry you are wrong.....this is not a senatorial race and you can fool the people of you state but not the whole nation.

Posted by: Jack Ball at August 11, 2004 07:38 AM

The Swiftboat vets have now had their say and now it is up to the voters to determine whether or not there is anything to it. I only hope that they and and the media give it the same attention and investigate to the same level to which they investigated the claims against Bush's national guard service.

I feel no pity at all for Sen. Kerry in this regard for two reasons. First, he chose to make Vietnam service the central tenet of his campaign and this invites close examination of his record. In fact it is the only qualification he has put forth of his ability to lead. One would think to watch that he walked straight off the battlefield covered in glory, took a shower and walked to the podium in Boston, skipping the entire 35 year period in between. Secondly he has done nothing to restrain the unadulterated filth emerging from "527" organizations dedicated to his cause. He is bullying TV stations who air the Swiftboat ads, but doing nothing to stop George Soros and his goons from morphing Bush into Hitler. The Bush campaign has quickly repudiated the Swiftboat ad and Kerry must unequivically repudiate MoveOn.org as well. Or he will simply invite more of the same.

Posted by: Michael P. Borgia at August 11, 2004 02:56 PM

Deserter!

Talk about hipocricy since taking office George W. has relished his so called version of the role of Commander in Chief.

His military record is disastrous. While he supported the Vietnam War, his family influence got him into the Texas Air National Guard, which, short of World War III breaking out, guaranteed that he would never see military action. Even in this safest of positions, Lieutenant Bush broke under the strain and went AWOL in Alabama for the better part of a year--canvassing for the Republican Party.

In contrast, George W. Bush's Administration calls up contemporary national Guardsmen for front-line action in Iraq, and extends their terms in a form of backdoor conscription. As the military budget soars, the war is being fought with a dangerously inadequate number of troops. Those troops who do eventually return in one piece find their veterans' medical benefits and facilities axed. Drawing on the President's STILL MYSTERIOUS MILITARY CAREEER, while the Republican Conservative Movement in this country is now trying to smear John Kerry and his service to our country Mr. Bush is guilty of breathtaking hypocrisy, cynical doublethink and egregious neglect of the actual defense of the United States.

Keep one thing in mind John Kerry went to war! He did not hide in the National Guard! To bad Nixon did not send the National Guard to Vietnam like W is sending them to IRAQ! Than again since he went AWOL he would not have served anyway!

Posted by: Louis (Canton, Ohio) at August 11, 2004 03:23 PM

Arly S., I think you missed the point. If all Kerry did was go to Vietnam and then come back and peacefully protest, I don't think there would be a problem. What he did according to the Swiftvets was come back and lie to Congress and as recently as 1986 repeated those lies on the Senate floor. This is not new; the main Swiftvet that wrote the book, John O'Neill was in a debate with Kerry on "The Dick Cavett Show" some 30 years ago challenging Kerry's war crimes claims. He comletely refuted him then and you are going to find Kerry having a hard time answering this one. Just watch, no records produced, no official statements from him, it will be just his spin machine personally attacking the Swiftvets.

Posted by: Ed at August 11, 2004 03:25 PM

February 1968:
Bush takes an Air
Force officers test.
SCORES 25th
percentile in the pilot
aptitude portion.
Declares that he does
not wish to serve
overseas.

May 27, 1968:
Bush enlists in Texas Air National Guard. Aided by Texas House Speaker Ben Barnes, he jumps over waiting list. He pledges two years of active duty and four years of reserve duty. June 9,

1968:
Bush's student deferment expires.
Bush on why the Air National Guard took him:
"They could sense I would be one of the great pilots of all time."
Houston Chronicle, August 1988

September 1968:
After basic training, Bush pulls inactive duty to act as gopher on Florida Senator Edward J. Gurney's campaign.
November 1968:
After Gurney wins, Bush is reactivated and transferred to Georgia.

November 1969:
Bush is flown to the White House by President Nixon for a date with daughter Tricia.
December 1969:
Bush transfers to Houston and moves into Chateaux Dijon complex. Laura lives there too, but they don't meet till later.

March 1970:
Bush gets his wings.

June 1970:
Joins the Guard's
"Champagne Unit," where
he flies with sons of Texas' elite.

November 3, 1970:
George Bush Sr. loses Senate election to Lloyd Bentsen, whose son is also in the "Champagne Unit."

November 7, 1970:
Promoted to first lieutenant. Rejected by University of Texas School of Law.

January 1971:
The Guard begins testing for drugs during physicals.

Spring 1971:
Hired by Texas agricultural importer, Bush uses F-102 to shuttle tropical plants from Florida.

May 26, 1972:
Transfers to Alabama Guard unit so he can work on Senator William Blount's reelection campaign. According to his commanding officer, Bush never shows up for duty while in Alabama, nor can anyone confirm he ever serves in the Guard again.

August 1972:
Bush is grounded for missing a mandatory physical.

November 1972:
Bush returns to Houston, but never reports for Guard duty.

Bush on commitment:
"I, George W. Bush, upon the successful completion of pilot training, plan to return to my unit and fulfill my obligation."
Air National Guard pledge, 1968

Bush on lessons learned:
"I learned some good lessons from Vietnam. First, there must be a clear mission. Secondly, the politics ought to stay out of fighting a war. There was too much politics during the Vietnam War."
Associated Press, March 2002

WHAT A FRICKING HIPOCRIT!

The RNC and the swift boat add has the nerve to question and smear Kerry? At least Kerry served and because Kerry laid his medals down because of the politics of Vietnam (The same thing W spoke of in March of 2002) Bush said he learned a lesson from Vietnam? John Kerry learned the hard way while being shot at defending his country not deserting it!

As John McCain noted, the television ad aired by these veterans is 'dishonest and dishonorable.' Sen. McCain called on President Bush to condemn the ad. Regrettably, the president has ignored Sen. McCain."

Bush: "I've been to war. I've raised twins. If I had a choice, I'd rather go to war."

As a candidate, you promised to "be a uniter, not a divider" ... "restore honor and integrity to the White House" ... and "change the tone in Washington."

What a JOKE!

Posted by: Louis (Canton, Ohio) at August 11, 2004 04:03 PM

FACTS ABOUT OL GEORGEY BOY!

The George W. Bush Military Record
by Jesse Brown
Former Secretary of Veterans Affairs
George W. Bush did not fulfill the military obligations that he committed himself to as a 21 year old in 1968. This happened because he quit flying in 1972 as a 25 year old with over 2 years of flying commitment still required.

The public should know that there have been misstatements and exaggerations on the part of Governor Bush and his staff to attempt to cover-up this lack of fulfillment of a commitment. The public has a right to know what really happened when meeting a military obligation when one seeks the Office of President of The United States.

(does this sound familiar?)
BUSH IS NOW ATTACKING KERRY THAT ALSO SERVED IN VIETNAM? HIS LAST TWO OPPONENTS SERVED AND HE WAS AWOL!

Al Gore volunteered and served in Vietnam meeting his obligation during the war. George W. Bush chose instead to join the Texas Air National Guard as a pilot but did not fulfill that obligation.

People may well forgive Governor Bush for what he did or did not do "in his youth." People are much less likely to be so forgiving if he is caught not telling the truth and covering up today. The press has an obligation to ask the candidate for a full explanation of his activities back then.

George W. Bush, in his official website information resume lists biographical facts which includes the following:

"Pilot, Texas Air National Guard, 1968-73"

George W. Bush, in his official biography to the National Governor's Association states:

"He was an F-102 fighter pilot in the Texas Air National Guard from 1968-1973"

This is not true! George W. Bush, on August 1, 1972, was suspended from flying status through verbal orders. Further, Major General Francis F. Greenlief confirmed this suspension in a letter of September 19, 1972. Lieutenant George W. Bush last flew an airplane for the United States Air National Guard in April of 1972.

He has in the past and continues to refuse to release his military records to allow the public to judge the circumstances surrounding his suspension. He further continues to cover-up the situation by representing to his fellow Governors and to the public at-large that he was a fighter pilot during 1973, when indeed he was suspended from flying a year before.

There are several other recent instances by Governor Bush and his staff of not telling the truth about his service to his country in the Air National Guard.

Examples include:

I. In his 1999 Autobiography, Governor Bush stated that after becoming a pilot "I flew for several years." This statement is an exaggeration. Bush flew as a pilot from November 1970 to April 1972, 17 months which does not classify as several years. In fact Bush's flying commitment was for 4 years (1970-1974) which would classify as "several years." However he chose not to accomplish his physical in 1972 and was suspended from flying by his supervisors.

II. Governor Bush stated in May 2000 that he was not able to accomplish his physical in 1972 because he was in Alabama and his doctor was in Houston. This is not true on three counts. First, Lt. Bush was not able to use his own physician for his physical. A pilot needs to accomplish his physical with a military physician. Second, being in Alabama was not a problem since there was no scarcity of flight surgeons in Montgomery, given the existence of two separate flying units in Alabama's capital - an Air Force Reserve airlift unit at Maxwell AFB, and an Air National Guard reconnaissance unit at Dannally Field. Indeed from May 1972 to September 1972 Bush was in Alabama so he certainly had time to accomplish his physical. And third, Bush returned to Houston in November and could have accomplished his physical at Ellington Air Force Base.

III. Governor Bush declared that he would have continued flying but they phased out his airplane, the F-102.

This is not true! The F-102 continued in service at Ellington Air Force Base until September 1974, after the time that Bush would have completed his full 6 year commitment. In fact, a second plane, the F-101, did not displace the F-102, but was added to the inventory of his unit. This allowed the unit to establish a second Combat Crew Training School to train F-101 air crews alongside F-102 crews.

Indeed his unit actually was placed in an alert status in 1972, meaning that more pilots were needed as of November 1972 just at the time Governor Bush should have taken his physical.

IV. On May 22, 2000, Bush campaign aide Mindy Tucker asserted that Governor Bush "fulfilled all of his requirements in the Guard. If he missed any drills, he made them up later on."

This response is geared to cover-up the fact that Bush never completed his pilot commitments. He claims he attended some non-flying drills (which are not reflected in his official military records) but these drills were not with his assigned unit and were not in conjunction with his pilot status. Indeed his official annual evaluation states "Lt. Bush has not been observed at this unit during the period of this report" May 1, 1972 to April 30, 1973.

Posted by: Louis (Canton, Ohio) at August 11, 2004 04:39 PM

Governor Bush stresses trustworthiness and truthfulness in his campaign. Lieutenant Bush assumed public trust in his military career during wartime. The public deserves an explanation about his actions, both then and now.

Right now, hundreds of American soldiers are dying and being wounded in a war that was sold to Americans on a shifting desert sand of lies. Most of the men who are responsible for sending our brave young men off to die were themselves cowards (Chickenhawks) who supported the Vietnam War, but sent other young men to die in their places.

The top two Chickenhawks, George W. Bush and Dick Cheney, had different excuses to explain the yellow streaks down their backs. Dick Cheney said he was too busy to go to Vietnam. George W. Bush said he was too busy patrolling the skies of Texas.

In memory of the young men in Vietnam who died in combat so that George and Dick could save their hides.

Here are the young men from Midland, Texas, (Bush's hometown) who died in Vietnam in place of George W. Bush, as he stayed in Texas afraid to go to war:

(1) LASTNAME: CUTBIRTH FIRSTNAME: KENDELL DWAYNE IDNO: 1912851 SVC: M COMP: R RANK: SSG GRADE: E6 MOS: 0369 AGE: 23 HOME: MIDLAND ST: TX CASDATE: 19670225 CAS1: A1 CAS2: G CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 01 LSVC: 06 BIRDATE: 19430429 RACE: C REL: PN MAR: M SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: ------ PANL: 15E LINE: 089 REFNO: 2287 PDATE: 6702

(2) LASTNAME: DYER FIRSTNAME: IRBY III IDNO: 458709452 SVC: A COMP: R RANK: SGT GRADE: E5 MOS: 91B40 AGE: 23 HOME: MIDLAND ST: TX CASDATE: 19661202 CAS1: A3 CAS2: B CAS3: 6 BODY: BNR CTRY: LA PROV: LZ LSVC: ** BIRDATE: 19430612 RACE: C REL: 99 MAR: M SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 661202 PANL: 13E LINE: 004 REFNO: 133 PDATE: 6701

(3) LASTNAME: GUERRERO FIRSTNAME: ANDREW CASTRO IDNO: 449984505 SVC: A COMP: R RANK: CPL PP: + GRADE: E3 MOS: 11B10 AGE: 19 HOME: MIDLAND ST: TX CASDATE: 19701217 CAS1: A1 CAS2: D CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 02 LSVC: ** BIRDATE: 19510516 RACE: C REL: RC MAR: S SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 700619 PANL: 06W LINE: 127 REFNO: 28717 PDATE: 7012

(4) LASTNAME: HALL FIRSTNAME: BRUCE IDNO: 18742754 SVC: A COMP: R RANK: SP4 GRADE: E4 MOS: 11B2P AGE: 19 HOME: MIDLAND ST: TX CASDATE: 19671227 CAS1: A1 CAS2: D CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 09 LSVC: 02 BIRDATE: 19480516 RACE: C REL: BO MAR: S SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 671003 PANL: 32E LINE: 072 REFNO: 9539 PDATE: 6712

(5) LASTNAME: HODGES FIRSTNAME: RUFUS WELDON IDNO: 54388226 SVC: A COMP: R RANK: SP4 GRADE: E4 MOS: 67V20 AGE: 21 HOME: MIDLAND ST: TX CASDATE: 19690117 CAS1: C1 CAS2: B CAS3: 6 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 26 LSVC: 01 BIRDATE: 19471017 RACE: C REL: BO MAR: M SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 680518 PANL: 34W LINE: 024 REFNO: 3232 PDATE: 6901

(6) LASTNAME: HOLLEY FIRSTNAME: GLYNN BYRON IDNO: 566821922 SVC: F COMP: R RANK: A1C GRADE: E3 MOS: ----- AGE: 20 HOME: MIDLAND ST: TX CASDATE: 19691226 CAS1: C2 CAS2: L CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 11 LSVC: 01 BIRDATE: 19490527 RACE: C REL: CC MAR: S SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 691206 PANL: 15W LINE: 093 REFNO: 427 PDATE: 6912

(7) LASTNAME: LOPEZ FIRSTNAME: PAULINO GUTIERREZ IDNO: 54382708 SVC: A COMP: Y RANK: PFC GRADE: E3 MOS: 11B10 AGE: 23 HOME: MIDLAND ST: TX CASDATE: 19670722 CAS1: A2 CAS2: D CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 25 LSVC: ** BIRDATE: 19440622 RACE: C REL: RC MAR: M SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 670501 PANL: 23E LINE: 106 REFNO: 7260 PDATE: 6707

(8) LASTNAME: MC KINNEY FIRSTNAME: CECIL CURTIS IDNO: 18728047 SVC: A COMP: R RANK: SP5 GRADE: E5 MOS: 91B2P AGE: 22 HOME: MIDLAND ST: TX CASDATE: 19681005 CAS1: A1 CAS2: I CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 02 LSVC: 02 BIRDATE: 19460926 RACE: C REL: BO MAR: S SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 670520 PANL: 41W LINE: 014 REFNO: 17621 PDATE: 6810

(9) LASTNAME: NIEDECKEN FIRSTNAME: RAYMOND ALVIS IDNO: 2353821 SVC: M COMP: R RANK: PFC GRADE: E2 MOS: 0311 AGE: 20 HOME: MIDLAND ST: TX CASDATE: 19671228 CAS1: A1 CAS2: D CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 03 LSVC: 00 BIRDATE: 19470812 RACE: C REL: PN MAR: S SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 671117 PANL: 32E LINE: 088 REFNO: 5441 PDATE: 6712

(10) LASTNAME: SATTERFIELD FIRSTNAME: HOWARD EUGENE IDNO: 525660321 SVC: A COMP: R RANK: SP5 GRADE: E5 MOS: 94B20 AGE: 37 HOME: MIDLAND ST: TX CASDATE: 19700829 CAS1: C2 CAS2: U CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 02 LSVC: ** BIRDATE: 19320909 RACE: C REL: 99 MAR: S SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 700219 PANL: 07W LINE: 023 REFNO: 5556 PDATE: 7008

(11) LASTNAME: SEGOVIA FIRSTNAME: RAUL LERMA IDNO: 54388602 SVC: A COMP: Y RANK: SP4 GRADE: E4 MOS: 11B20 AGE: 20 HOME: MIDLAND ST: TX CASDATE: 19690130 CAS1: C1 CAS2: V CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 07 LSVC: 00 BIRDATE: 19480330 RACE: C REL: RC MAR: S SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 680909 PANL: 33W LINE: 022 REFNO: 3271 PDATE: 6901

(12) LASTNAME: SIMMONS FIRSTNAME: TRAVIS A JR IDNO: 7715206 SVC: N COMP: V RANK: HM3 GRADE: E4 MOS: HM3 AGE: 23 HOME: MIDLAND ST: TX CASDATE: 19670316 CAS1: A1 CAS2: D CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 05 LSVC: 02 BIRDATE: 19430827 RACE: C REL: PN MAR: S SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: ------ PANL: 16E LINE: 098 REFNO: 240 PDATE: 6703

(13) LASTNAME: STALL FIRSTNAME: WILLIAM ROBB IDNO: 2303522 SVC: M COMP: R RANK: LCPL GRADE: E3 MOS: 0846 AGE: 20 HOME: MIDLAND ST: TX CASDATE: 19680118 CAS1: A1 CAS2: G CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 01 LSVC: 00 BIRDATE: 19470214 RACE: C REL: PN MAR: M SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 670922 PANL: 34E LINE: 071 REFNO: 5613 PDATE: 6801

(14) LASTNAME: TAYLOR FIRSTNAME: SELVWYN RISHER IDNO: W3161245 SVC: A COMP: V RANK: WO GRADE: W1 MOS: 061B AGE: 31 HOME: MIDLAND ST: TX CASDATE: 19690316 CAS1: C1 CAS2: B CAS3: 1 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 30 LSVC: 12 BIRDATE: 19371218 RACE: C REL: RC MAR: M SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 680819 PANL: 29W LINE: 056 REFNO: 3435 PDATE: 6903

(15) LASTNAME: WATSON FIRSTNAME: GARY EUGENE IDNO: 54387872 SVC: A COMP: Y RANK: SP4 GRADE: E4 MOS: 11B20 AGE: 24 HOME: MIDLAND ST: TX CASDATE: 19680403 CAS1: A1 CAS2: H CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 06 LSVC: 01 BIRDATE: 19440318 RACE: C REL: CC MAR: S SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 670725 PANL: 47E LINE: 057 REFNO: 12830 PDATE: 6804

(16) LASTNAME: ZONNE FIRSTNAME: ROBERT JOHN JR IDNO: 462620728 SVC: A COMP: R RANK: CPT GRADE: O3 MOS: 0200 AGE: 27 HOME: MIDLAND ST: TX CASDATE: 19700420 CAS1: C1 CAS2: B CAS3: 6 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 25 LSVC: 04 BIRDATE: 19420528 RACE: C REL: EP MAR: M SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 690718 PANL: 11W LINE: 029 REFNO: 5085 PDATE: 7004

Here are young men from Casper, Wyoming, (Dick Cheney's hometown), who died in Vietnam in place of Cheney, who said that he had "important things" that kept him from fighting for his beliefs:

(1) LASTNAME: BARNES FIRSTNAME: ROBERT EUGENE IDNO: 16915925 SVC: A COMP: R RANK: SP4 GRADE: E4 MOS: 91B20 AGE: 20 HOME: CASPER ST: WY CASDATE: 19680607 CAS1: A1 CAS2: G CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 27 LSVC: 01 BIRDATE: 19480502 RACE: C REL: PB MAR: S SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 680102 PANL: 59W LINE: 019 REFNO: 15220 PDATE: 6806

(2) LASTNAME: BYERS FIRSTNAME: JERRY DUANE IDNO: 55874873 SVC: A COMP: Y RANK: SP4 GRADE: E4 MOS: 91B20 AGE: 20 HOME: CASPER ST: WY CASDATE: 19670301 CAS1: A1 CAS2: E CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 23 LSVC: 01 BIRDATE: 19460717 RACE: C REL: BO MAR: S SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 660823 PANL: 15E LINE: 126 REFNO: 4983 PDATE: 6703

(3) LASTNAME: CARDENAS FIRSTNAME: LEROY ROBERT IDNO: 54905640 SVC: A COMP: Y RANK: PFC GRADE: E3 MOS: 11B10 AGE: 23 HOME: CASPER ST: WY CASDATE: 19690604 CAS1: A1 CAS2: D CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 23 LSVC: 00 BIRDATE: 19460511 RACE: C REL: RC MAR: S SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 690407 PANL: 23W LINE: 062 REFNO: 22646 PDATE: 6906

(4) LASTNAME: ENDICOTT FIRSTNAME: RICHARD LEROY IDNO: OF104722 SVC: A COMP: R RANK: CPT GRADE: O3 MOS: 1542 AGE: 25 HOME: CASPER ST: WY CASDATE: 19680430 CAS1: A1 CAS2: E CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 42 LSVC: 02 BIRDATE: 19421114 RACE: C REL: LU MAR: S SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 680303 PANL: 53E LINE: 011 REFNO: 13624 PDATE: 6804

(5) LASTNAME: GROVE FIRSTNAME: ROBERT WOODROW IDNO: 306455 SVC: M COMP: R RANK: GSGT GRADE: E7 MOS: 0369 AGE: 47 HOME: CASPER ST: WY CASDATE: 19650218 CAS1: A1 CAS2: D CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 11 LSVC: 20 BIRDATE: 19170301 RACE: C REL: PN MAR: M SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: ------ PANL: 01E LINE: 092 REFNO: 13 PDATE: 6502

(6) LASTNAME: HANDY FIRSTNAME: WALTER ELMER IDNO: 54901810 SVC: A COMP: Y RANK: PFC GRADE: E3 MOS: 64B20 AGE: 26 HOME: CASPER ST: WY CASDATE: 19680313 CAS1: A1 CAS2: V CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 08 LSVC: 00 BIRDATE: 19410927 RACE: C REL: AD MAR: M SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 671216 PANL: 44E LINE: 036 REFNO: 12378 PDATE: 6803

(7) LASTNAME: HOLLAND FIRSTNAME: CARLTON JAKE IDNO: O2270112 SVC: A COMP: V RANK: CPT GRADE: O3 MOS: 82162 AGE: 36 HOME: CASPER ST: WY CASDATE: 19650209 CAS1: A3 CAS2: H CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 99 LSVC: 18 BIRDATE: 19280531 RACE: C REL: BO MAR: M SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: ------ PANL: 01E LINE: 086 REFNO: 200 PDATE: 6502

(8) LASTNAME: KASTNER FIRSTNAME: RICHARD THOMAS IDNO: 520563368 SVC: A COMP: Y RANK: PFC GRADE: E3 MOS: 11B10 AGE: 20 HOME: CASPER ST: WY CASDATE: 19691115 CAS1: A1 CAS2: G CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 14 LSVC: 00 BIRDATE: 19490227 RACE: C REL: RC MAR: M SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 690924 PANL: 16W LINE: 080 REFNO: 25172 PDATE: 6911

(9) LASTNAME: NIX FIRSTNAME: VERNON WALTER III IDNO: 16915371 SVC: A COMP: R RANK: SSG PP: + GRADE: E5 MOS: 11B4P AGE: 19 HOME: CASPER ST: WY CASDATE: 19680429 CAS1: A1 CAS2: D CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 02 LSVC: 01 BIRDATE: 19481216 RACE: C REL: PN MAR: M SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 680402 PANL: 53E LINE: 003 REFNO: 14026 PDATE: 6805

(10) LASTNAME: PATRICK FIRSTNAME: DOUGLAS TYRONE IDNO: 55809144 SVC: A COMP: Y RANK: PFC GRADE: E3 MOS: 11H10 AGE: 19 HOME: CASPER ST: WY CASDATE: 19660806 CAS1: C1 CAS2: C CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 99 LSVC: 00 BIRDATE: 19460828 RACE: C REL: PN MAR: S SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 660609 PANL: 09E LINE: 108 REFNO: 597 PDATE: 6608

(11) LASTNAME: REBERG FIRSTNAME: CHARLES WAYNE IDNO: 16914092 SVC: A COMP: R RANK: SGT PP: + GRADE: E4 MOS: 11C2P AGE: 20 HOME: CASPER ST: WY CASDATE: 19680421 CAS1: A1 CAS2: H CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 02 LSVC: 01 BIRDATE: 19471030 RACE: C REL: LU MAR: S SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 671201 PANL: 51E LINE: 024 REFNO: 13662 PDATE: 6804

(12) LASTNAME: SWEENEY FIRSTNAME: RICHARD JOHN IDNO: 54903457 SVC: A COMP: Y RANK: SP4 GRADE: E4 MOS: 11B20 AGE: 21 HOME: CASPER ST: WY CASDATE: 19690223 CAS1: A1 CAS2: D CAS3: 7 BODY: --- CTRY: VS PROV: 22 LSVC: 01 BIRDATE: 19470904 RACE: C REL: LU MAR: S SEX: M CIT: 1 TOURD: 680623 PANL: 31W LINE: 025 REFNO: 19992 PDATE: 6902

Nothing more vividly illustrates the gap between the image of Bush and Cheney as "wise, seasoned leaders of a nation at war" than their cowardliness in supporting the Vietnam War while running from combat with a yellow streak down their backs.

The Bush/Cheney Vietnam evasion also plays a significant role in understanding how an ill-prepared war cabinet composed primarily of Vietnam Chickenhawks put our young soldiers at risk by overruling the advice of Pentagon generals, analysis from the CIA, and common sense in launching an ill-advised war.

Posted by: Louis (Canton, Ohio) at August 11, 2004 04:53 PM

Louis (Canton, Ohio) at August 11, 2004 04:53 PM

WOW Louis, That is horrible, but I believe it to be absolutely true. GW Bush JR sometimes frightenes me, but I now realize his whole campaign and administration is run by putting fear in the minds of American people for their own personal gain, when in fact the are a bunch of Cowards!!! Cowards!!! Cowards!!!

Vote: Kerry/Edwards Take America Away From Cowards!

Posted by: D. jones at August 11, 2004 06:49 PM

The one thing I think most people are forgetting is that Bush is not trying to base his re-election on his service record. He has done a great job with the war on terrorism. We have not had one attack on American soil since 9/11. I would have to say that is a major accomplishment. Kerry is the one that put himself in the hotseat with his service record. For all of you who think he is some war hero, come on....4 months. I don't really feel one way or the other about the swiftboat ad, but I do have strong feelings on Michael Moore's F9/11. He is putting that propaganda out there for other countries to see. Is is me or does that make us look weak. I did not like Clinton, I felt he was morally bankrupt but I would not go to other countries at a time of war and bash him to people who already think we are evil and are so jealous of us they try to kill us. The Kerryoniraq.com video should put doubt in all of you Kerry supporters eyes. Watch it and then come back and say he means what he says and say what he meant...yesterday, when it benefitted him to do so. This guy is a joke. Our current President is a man of integrity and morality which is much more than we had previously, he would never put anyone in harms way if it could be helped. If we had not gone into Iraq and something else(any act of terrorism) happened the dems would have spun it to be his fault anyway. Either way watch the video, Kerry said in there on several media broadcast Saddam needed to be dealt with he was an enormous threat. And what if Kerry did win and something happened to him health wise, do you really have that much confidence in Edwards, come on he is an ambulance chaser who has cost the American consumers millions of dollars over frivilous lawsuits. Open your eyes people, get the facts, all of them, don't listen to one source, check them all out, but make sure to watch the video of KerryonIraq.com. It is actual feed of him making statements, how can you deny that.

Bush/Cheney Keep America Safe!!!!

Posted by: Amy G at August 11, 2004 06:56 PM

Amy,

If GW JR is doing such a great job, can you please tell me where Osama Bin Laden is? I would immediately contact the authorities if only someone would tell where the man responsible for 911 is. We as Americans spent billions on a war in Iraq, later changed to the name "War On Terrorism" (it sounds better to the American people), and still don't have a clue where Osama Bin Laden is. Don't believe the lies, Sadaam had no ties to Osama Bin Laden if so they probably would have hid near each other, but GW JR. put Osama on the back burner to go after Saadam (Which in fact, Saadam needed ousting); however, America still doesn't know where Osama Bin Laden the man responsible for 911 is. Where ever he is, I bet is still recruiting American haters!

Vote: Kerry/Edwards

Posted by: D. jones at August 11, 2004 07:44 PM

I think it is pathetic that anyone would bash on a candidate for showing their pride as a willing serviceman in the VietNam war in order to help his campaign. Everyone who has commented on this subject knows damn well that Bush would be tooting his horn if he had any kind of decent military record. I guess him flying onto the aircraft carrier with "Mission Accomplished" wasn't a way of plugging himself?

Admit it everyone, if Bush would have gone to VietNam you all would be kissing his ass to high heaven.

In this election year it is not about the differences between Democrats/Republicans and Liberals/Conservatives. It is about everyone coming to terms with Bush's poor representation as a president. The republicans need to accept the blow to their egos and find someone more fit to run in 2008. Really, it is an ABB (anybody but Bush) year.

Vote Kerry/Edward 2004

Posted by: P. Smith at August 11, 2004 07:50 PM

I am a registered Democrat an have been for 30+yrs. I served two(2)tours of duty in Viet-Nam
1965 and 1969 For a total of 19 mos.I applaude these swift vets for coming forward. Kerry made his Viet-nam service His platform for president instead of his SENATE RECORD!!!and it looks like neither one of them can stand much scrutiny.And being a fisherman on the coast of NC I dont have to be in the boat next to me to see whos drinking soda or beer or if they are catching fish and what kind it is but I'd have to guess at the weight.And I would Know if they were in trouble or not.Thats part of Boating observing what is going on around you. The man rescued that day was not the only one saved in the incident there where three others and the one Kerry saved and is using was only on the boat for the rest of the day he was not assigned to the Crew

Posted by: Thomas Dickerson at August 11, 2004 10:17 PM

The Bin Laden question, d., was answered first by David (not me) on this very forum on August 6, 9:16 am:
"...Things to look forward to:

"Weapons of Mass Destruction found and accounted for sometime in mid-October and Osama Bin Laden arrested in late October to early November.

"There I have said it, I have made my prediction. And just you wait, all the democrats will fall in line like Howard Dean is right now in saying "Oh yeah, such interesting timing for this information to be released just before the election". Well they called the thunder in the 2000 election, so they will get what's coming to them! Don't you think if George W. Bush's DUI was such crucial information that it would be released sooner than a week before the election? But noooooo, they probably claim that they just received the tip the day before they released it.

"I personally disagree with these tactics, but I'm still mad as hell that the democrats started it and I'm looking forward to George W. Bush ending it in November.

"So for all you Democrats out there, please by all means keep running your mouths about the war in Afganistan and the war in Iraq. Keep asking us where the weapons of mass destruction are. Keep asking us where Osama Bin Laden is. We'll tell you in a few months".

Wait for it. And then, enjoy Kerry's concession speech. I know I will. :}

Posted by: Dave at August 11, 2004 11:48 PM

Several weeks ago I read the July 9, 2004, interview that master documentary filmmaker Michael Moore gave to the magazine Entertainment Weekly. In it he stated, "I don't get sued because my facts are correct." He continued, and I quote, "My opinions are my own and they may or may not be correct, but let's have that debate."
I THOROUGHLY AGREE. Challenge his opinions as did Dave Kopel in his "Fifty-nine Deceits in Fahrenheit 9/11," available through the Independence Institute and found on the internet.
Now if I'm not mistaken, some Democrats and others
think that Mr. Moore hung the moon and that his documentary Fahrenheit 9/11 is the absolute truth.
So I would think that if it is fair to show this movie throughout the United States and abroad, what is wrong with the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth presenting their opinion of what they think John Kerry did or how he acted in Vietnam?
The fact is, John Kerry did serve in Vietnam, but the veterans opinion is "how he served?" Kerry has made his service in Vietnam the centerpiece of his presidential campaign. Just as Michael Moore questions whether George Bush has told the public the truth on several issues, these veterans have a right to question whether John Kerry told the truth. I don't understand the leaders of the Democratic campaign attempting to block the veteran campaign ads by using lawyers to threaten TV stations, nor do I understand their screaming "foul play." There are already Kerry Washington staffers and web sites attempting to discredit the Swift Boat Veterans and the book Unfit for Command. Why don't we let the public read and hear about both sides of the issue or opinion (if they can find the information, because some of the mnedia doesn't seem to want to cover it) and let the public make up its own mind.

Posted by: Bill W. at August 12, 2004 01:56 AM

Injustices of war don't always have to involve torture or murder of detainees.

Soldier's Carjacking Court-Martial Begins

August 11, 2004 11:59 PM EDT

FORT CAMPBELL, Ky. - An Army lieutenant allegedly ordered his soldiers to find him a vehicle after his broke down, then tried to cover up the theft of a sheik's SUV in Iraq, military prosecutors said Wednesday.

In opening statements at the court-martial of 1st Lt. Bradley Pavlik, prosecutor Capt. Howard Hoege said the officer "led his platoon down a road of misconduct."

Vote: Kerry/Edwards 2004

Posted by: Texans4Kerry at August 12, 2004 02:53 AM

How many Americans do you know that are running for the President of our United States that has written and had published a book showing on its front cover, our American Flag flying UPSIDE DOWN? If you don’t have enough respect for our flag, to display it the way it SHOULD BE. Then the least anyone should is "JUST NOT DISPLAY IT AT ALL". Visit http://www.kerry-04.org/war/ to view this disgraceful act.

Posted by: Sherman at August 12, 2004 08:38 AM

I can't believe the arguments some of you people are making. Listen to yourselves and see how irrational most of these comments are!!
Bashing Bush because of his military record is absurd. Bush may have did things to avoid going to war, but so did Kerry. The difference is that Kerry was unsuccessful, don't make it out to be that Kerry felt it was his patriotic duty to go to Vietnam. The whole argument of military record would have meant nothing had Kerry not tried using it to get elected. If I remember correctly, Clinton dodged the draft, but that must be ok because he is a Democrat.
And Moore's F-911 is a bunch of crap. He has said himself that the film depicts his personal opinions. Using cut and paste truths, Moore made a film to push the Democrat's agenda. Moore is not an idiot, he knows that some people will take it for the honest to God truth, and that may sway votes in favor of Kerry.
And then you have the Osama Bin Laden arguments. I was wondering how long it would take for that one. Let's keep in mind we are not the only group looking for him. It's not like he's wearing a neon sign 24/7 until we find him. The real problem lies within the lack of intelligence we had in the middle east prior to 9-11. Take a lucky guess who was responsible for that. It wasn't Bush, it was Clinton. We at one time had the opportunity to get Bin Laden and we didn't. Would that have avoided 9-11? Who knows, but the fact is that pointing fingers at Bush for not having him yet is a pretty bold statement considering Clinton could have already had him or at least had the intelligence in place to find him more easily.
Armchair quarterbacking is easy, try being the one at the moment. Bush is doing a fine job, he has faced more in the first year of his Presidency that any other President for the past 30 years. And yet there is a vast amount of voters who will be swayed by the people like Moore, people who will vote for Kerry simply because they are like sheep that follow whatever the reporters on CNN tell them, swallowing every last bit of partisan slop thrown in front of them.
Stay the course/Vote Bush

Posted by: Chad B at August 12, 2004 11:47 AM

Shame on The Bush Administration!

http://www.eriposte.com/media/liars_inc/swiftboat.htm

What is even more remarkable is that SBV's hateful mendacity is nothing other than a direct attack on the integrity of the American Armed Forces - something that Republicans like them claim to hold dear.

It has struck me lately what a terrible indictment of the military these charges are and how once again the Republicans have absolutely no limits in terms of how fully they are willing to trash the American institutions they allegedly love in order to win. What these people are saying is that the US Navy awarded some of its highest medals for bravery to a coward. The many officers who signed those glowing fitness reports and awarded those citations are either liars or they are incompetent. The word of his shipmates, even the man whose life he saved, are worth nothing. You can't believe military documentary evidence. It was all b***s***, every last piece of it.
And because of this it can now be said that all medals awarded for bravery are suspect. A superior military record is no longer a recommendation. Who can ever believe the government on this issue, now?

Posted by: d. jones at August 12, 2004 12:00 PM

When Voting for a President it is best to gage their truefullness by looking at their Record not Media statements.

Posted by: Gene Little at August 12, 2004 06:31 PM

Ok folks since you still want to argue about gwb vs Kerry instead of the truthfulness of the swiftvets ad, let's look at members of gwb's administration that help guide gwb in his daily decisions:

Wolfowitz- a member of PNAC. Never served in the military.

Cheney- a member of PNAC. Never served in the military.

Rumsfeld- a member of PNAC. Never served in the military.

Libby- a member of PNAC. Never served in the military.

Perle- a member of PNAC. Never served in the military.

What is PNAC? The Project for the New American Century. http://newamericancentury.org

This organization has many members and before 9/11 hoped that a "New Pearl Habor" would give them ability to impliment their stated agenda, which includes:

Invading Iraq.
Removing Liberties/Freedoms from citizens.
Forcing US policies on the World.

Truthfully folks, if this doesn't make you want to vote for Kerry I doubt there is anything that would sway you to make the right choice for humanity.

Posted by: X at August 12, 2004 08:24 PM

This is the great left’s hypocrisy trying to minimized the serve in the service, “like what is is” if you believe them Kerry only served with the men on his boat, regardless of the 220 plus people in his company that was around him on a daily basis, going on this I guess I didn’t serve with the 1st Armor Division, nor did I serve with the FSB Battalion nor did I serve with D Company nor did I serve with the 3 other platoons I only served with the 8 other guys in my squad, this is BS and all Veterans know it!!!

Posted by: D. Walker at August 12, 2004 09:05 PM

I am a registered Democrat and have been all my life, however, John Kerry is a disgrace to this Great Country and will not get my vote. President George Bush is my kind of Stand-up-guy who believe in America and it's values. John Kerry is not and has proved it by his voting record in Washington.

What has happened to the people of America? Are we now so bitter we blindly vote with emotions and not common sense.

Posted by: J. Dickens at August 12, 2004 09:29 PM

In all honesty, who cares who Kerry served with, at least he did serve! To call the American Military a lie by giving medals of honor should be considered treason! GW JR. completely avoided the war and thought he had his record closed! (by executive order as Commander and Chief Of the American Armed Forces). Let's face the facts, he is a coward hiding behind the Presidency and Republican Party!

Vote: Kerry/Edwards 2004

Posted by: d.jones at August 12, 2004 09:52 PM

How many people posting on this site were over the age of 18 in 1971?

I was, and I remember the pain of soldiers coming home from Vietnam and being spit on and called baby killers. Why? Because of John "turncoat" Kerry and his commie friends.

Do any of you know how many people died and were tortured because of John Kerry's testimony in Congress? Including John Mccain.

Does anyone remember how almost every college in the US was closed down for over a month in January - February 1971 for a "moratorium" because John Kerry was lying to Congress?

Does anybody remember how much damage John Kerry and his buddies did to the morale of this country?
It took 20 years to restore it.

Does anybody realize what Jane Fonda did while cavorting with the Viet Cong? She met with American POWS and asked them "how it felt to be baby killers" while these poor guys slipped her small pieces of paper with their Social Security numbers on them so she could take them home and let the government know they were alive. What did John Kerry's buddy do with these scraps of paper? She promptly turned them over to the Commander. As a result of this highest form of treason three of those men died and a fourth survived the torture, and he is the one who lived to tell the story.

WAKE UP AMERICA!! REMEMBER WHAT WAS DONE TO OUR VETS AND MORALE IN 1971 THANKS TO JOHN KERRY

Posted by: Calamity Jane at August 12, 2004 10:56 PM

I just want to ask one question! How does serving in the military make you qualified to run a country? So, what you Kerry supporters are saying is if I join the military, for 4 months go to Iraq and fight or sit on a ship in the water waiting for a fight to come, that would make me more qualified than a man who has not served 4 months. Seems to me you need intelligence and morality more than the ability to fire a gun or ride on a boat. I am in no way trying to say there is anything wrong with serving your country, thank God for those of you that have and do. But it does not make you qualified to be the President if you served 4 months 30 years ago. Just my opinion. Oh and a question that was asked of me from my last comment, where is Osama, he is in Pakistan, they just can't go in and get him because it could have their current leader over thrown and cause major conflict. Don't you worry, we will get him. At least Bush has him on the run and he is not sitting in a cave with no fears planning an attack for who knows how many years like he did with the last President.

Posted by: Amy at August 13, 2004 08:41 AM

I was a child in Denver and would visit the Air Force Base there during the Vietnam war. Remembering through the eyes of a kid my main question was WHY! I still have those same questions to this date! It wasn't all Kerry's fault as some want us to believe. Here is a couple of links as to Why!

http://ohoh.essortment.com/vietnamwarprot_rlcz.htm
http://www.english.uiuc.edu/maps/vietnam/causes.htm

Seven presidents were involved with decisions that impacted Americas presence in Vietnam: Truman, Roosevelt, Eisenhower, Kennedy, Johnson, Nixon and Ford.

Once the draft was introduced young people on college and university campuses all around the country began to organise protests against the war. Teach-ins and student organizations like the SDS (Students for a Democratic Society) held rallies and marches, the first of which happened in Washington in April of 1965. Over the next 2 years the anti-war movement snow balled. Activists, celebrities and musicians like Abbie Hoffmann, Timothy Leary, Allen Ginsberg, Jane Fonda, Jimi Hendrix, Jefferson Airplane, and countless others took up the Anti-war cause and waved Anti-war banners. Their speeches and their music reflected the anger and hopelessness that Americans felt over the Vietnam war. Even the GIs stationed overseas began supporting the Anti-war movement in whatever capacity they could, from wearing peace symbols to refusing to obey orders.

Over 50,000 Americans were killed and many of those who returned suffered and still suffer deep physical and emotional scars. Many more veterans took their own lives, were treated as social outcasts or ended up on Americas streets among the homeless. What the war did to Vietnam and to the Vietnamese people was even more drastic. By the time Saigon fell to invading North Vietnamese forces on April 29, 1975, close to 2 million Vietnamese had died

Kerry couldn't possibly the blame for all this. He participated and like many others didn't like what he saw, and neither did I.

Vote: Kerry/Edwards 2004

Posted by: d. jones at August 13, 2004 10:31 AM

RE: my last comment, where is Osama, he is in Pakistan, they just can't go in and get him because it could have their current leader over thrown and cause major conflict.

They Can't? They invaded Afganistan, They invaded Iraq? The mighty GW JR. afraid of overthrowing a leader and causing major conflict. Pleaseeeeee, give me a break!

Vote: Kerry/Edwards

Posted by: d. jones at August 13, 2004 11:01 AM

D. WALKER JUST BECAUSE YOU SAY IN YOUR COMMENT THAT YOU ARE REGISTERED AS A DEM DOES NOT MAKE YOU ONE! YOUR COMMENTS ARE PROOF THAT YOU ARE NOT EVEN CLOSE TO BEING A DEMOCRATE SO QUICK SAYING YOU ARE ONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by: D. Walker at August 12, 2004 09:05 PM

I am a registered Democrat and have been all my life, however, John Kerry is a disgrace to this Great Country and will not get my vote. President George Bush is my kind of Stand-up-guy who believe in America and it's values. John Kerry is not and has proved it by his voting record in Washington.

What has happened to the people of America? Are we now so bitter we blindly vote with emotions and not common sense.

YOU ARE NOT A DEMOCRATE!

Posted by: Louis (Canton, Ohio) at August 13, 2004 11:07 AM

Calamity Jane, I ask you also what makes someone that went AWOL when he was in the service, was the Governor of what is known as one of the two weakest Governorships in the Union (TEXAS) Qualified to be our President? What makes him not qualified is his lies that took us to war in IRAQ not Afganistan where we should be massing our troops to fight the war on Terror. Now, we are only making the nuts in the middle east hate us even more. We have now pissed on and pissed off the world. Our country is not safer today we are more at risk and George W's failed policies in the Middle East will keep our country in danger for generations to come!

Posted by: Louis (Canton, Ohio) at August 13, 2004 11:14 AM

"Hoping for a new Pearl Harbor?!? Removing Liberties from citizens?!?" Holy cow. Decocrats believe that the Holy Mother Government is God, has a divine mission of spreading the Gospel of "we-know-what's-better-for-you-than-you-do" and "if-you-don't-like-it, we'll-force-you-to-do-it-by-law-anyway" has a problem with this? Unless, of course, they didn't think of it first...

Posted by: Dave at August 13, 2004 11:38 AM

To Louis from Canton, Ohio

What proof do you have that Bush was AWOL?
Also, I was discussing the damage done by Kerry in 1971, which has nothing to do with Bush.

As far as I am concerned if four months in Vietnam qualifies you to be president, then that means a janitor who has worked at a company for four months is qualified to be CEO. This is common sense.

Bush-Cheney '04

Posted by: Calamity Jane at August 13, 2004 04:46 PM

To X

Invading Iraq - the right thing to do.
Removing Liberties/Freedoms from citizens - tell me which freedoms you have lost? I have asked this very question to every Dem I know